And another thing…

I hate to say it Tom but what a load of crap. What the electorate will see is a doomed governing party that cares more about sabotaging its succesors than it does about doing the right thing. I have no time for Nadine Dorries but the election of Bercow shows contempt for the public and you are whistling in the wind (again) if you imagine people will blame the tories for this shameful debacle.

Dhanda was bloody good, wasn’t he? It’s a shame that people concentrate too much on the horse race and the politics of it – because if they’d simply been voting on the speeches, he’d have been in with a shout.

Ditto the Carswell comment.

It astonishes me all this talk of “if his own party don’t like him then he’s out next election”.

He is now The Speaker – with no party. Surely the last thing anyone wants is someone in the chair that is beholden to their previous political colleagues?!?

Good luck to him – I think he will be an assett to the House.

Nads falls into the same camp as Boris and Cameron. They are most definitely valuable electoral assets. No more #sackdorries please, let’s make it #dorriesforpm

It’s a bit rich to harp on about democracy and it’s consequences, Tom:

1) Whilst I know that a Prime Minister is not directly elected; in most people’s eyes Gordon Brown does not have a mandate to govern. At least if he’d won an election as leader of the Labour Party the losers of the vote would have to accept the result

2) The Electorate also dislike unelected representatives; and this Labour Government is full of them.

3) Are you telling us that no Labour MPs voted for Bercow just to annoy the Tories?

cheers

Oh yes, and has anyone come across a more unpleasant, narcissistic or less intelligent MP than Nadine Dorries. I honestly think it’d be an excellent move if every Labour blogger on the Internet put big banner links to her blog on theirs.

I’ve got no real opinion on Bercow being made Speaker. I’m happy to see what he does before making a judgement.

However, anything that annoys Nadine Dorries (Cons. MP for Little-Martyrdom-under-Whine) is a-OK with me.

It’s we the Electorate who aren’t happy seeing Labour using the election of the Speaker to spite David Cameron and the Tories.

We had expectations that M.P.s had learnt something from the Expenses Scandal about what we hope for from them: but no, you ignore us and carry on playing your silly games of yah boo politics.

As Parmjit Dhanda says: you M.P.s just don’t get it. I’ve traditionally voted Labour but never again: you sold us out years ago.

I agree with your comments. Surprised that you did not vote for John Bercow although I have a soft spot for Sir George Young. On balance, I wanted a younger person in the role!

I was appalled at how many on the Tory benches reacted to a democratic election conducted in secrecy. Their actions were childish and again showed just how out of touch they are with the public. Astonishing that they do not agree with a democratic vote and I am disgusted that some are already seeking to oust the new Speaker even before he takes up the job. Perhaps the public who witnessed their representatives behaving in such an unprofessional manner may use their democratic vote to oust them! I hope some are taken to task by their constituency party in letting down their party and electorate. A party that seeks to govern needs to ensure they are not seen as nasty. I thought some of the Tory MPs were nasty. Nadine Dorries wrote a ghastly article in the newspapers over the weekend. Silly woman sought to excuse her writing by getting agreement from senior members of her party. She is being used as cannon fodder – I am sure the same members would not besmirch their names by penning the same unprofessional article. I do not expect elected representatives to be downright rude, unprofessional, cheap, and to criticise colleagues in the national press. They are not worthy to sit in the centre of our democracy. Perhaps her views appeal to some who read the rag that she wrote for – they do not with many and we are the ones who determine who wins elections! I am of course delighted that her comment together with some of the right wing journalists who share her views were totally ignored by those voting. Do they not realize how small minded and pathetic they are? We do not appreciate vitriolic attacks on others even if we do not share their views. The opposite – we will always go for the underdog or support those who we judge are being attacked unfairly.

I wish the new Speaker well. I also hope he is given time to learn the job – Betty Boothroyd had a shaky start and look at what a wonderful Speaker she became. I also hope that David Cameron takes action, if at all possible, against some of his colleagues for undermining the new speaker and the democratic wishes of the House!

Like all sensible Tories, I would rather judge Bercow on his performance as speaker rather than on anything he has done to date. In fact, his elevation should cancel out his entire political history to date for all meaningful purposes.

On the other hand, glad to know you disapprove of partisanship, screeching or otherwise and will be working to eliminate it from your own party.

The Tories could do worse than emulating Carswell over Dorries on every other issue as well.

I’m a Tory and once again it’s a pleasure to agree with you Tom, even though I am feeling about as happy as Margaret Becket’s blind date.

Nadine reminds me very strongly of a wife I once had. Quite attractive in a way but she has that second wives trick of combining shrill self-righteousness with a hysterical lack of serious thought.

There’s no doubt that we all must accept the result of the ballot, even the Tory MPs who presumably know Bercow best. But y’know, he is just the sort of smug, self satisfied sh** that gives MPs a bad name.

I agree with you. I also heard Dorries on the Today programme, and witnessed her pathetic behaviour – along with other Tories I hasten to add – when he was selected. Also, more than her alleged ‘only three’ Tories initially applauded the House’s choice, from what I could see from the TV coverage, although the majority of them then had to be pushed into a standing ovation for him.
Douglas Carswell has certainly risen in my estimation after listening to him this morning.

areweallcalledrichard: “you are whistling in the wind (again) if you imagine people will blame the tories for this shameful debacle”

I don’t expect anyone to get “the blame” for the election of a new Speaker. I expect people to be interested.

Three Tory MP’s voted for him. What does that tell you? The rest were either Lib Dems or Labour. Seeing that Labour have the majority of votes, they voted him in KNOWING FULL WELL IT WOULD ANNOY THE TORIES.

It’s this sort of playground behaviour that makes Labour look increasingly stupid I’m afraid. There were far better candidates, with far less scandal surrounding their expenses. We now have a man with no ethics or morals, heading a house with no ethics or morals… nice going!

It was a childish thing to do!

So, the last two speakers have received a combined total of 4 votes from the Conservatives versus approximately 500 votes from the the Labour Party and Liberal Democrats.

I wonder why they’re annoyed?

“The elctorate don’t like sore losers,”

they also dont like political one up man ship and games, So why was not frank Field elected? Because he would not accept the status quo!…and what does that say about this current Parliament?

The Labour party has many more questions to answer than the Conservative party Tom.

‘Nadine reminds me very strongly of a wife I once had. Quite attractive in a way but she has that second wives trick of combining shrill self-righteousness with a hysterical lack of serious thought.’

Thanks for that. Well, you married her. My question is: how many second wives does a man have to have before he starts to notice the tendency you describe? I mean, I’d like to know because I’m on my second wife at the moment, no, no I don’t mean, damn, stop digging when you’re in a …

Ah, drat. Bloody internet. Where’s the delete button? ‘Submit comment’. That must be it.

Good post, Tom. Personally, I wanted Ann Widdecombe. We needed a Tory and somehow she seems right for the role. I have my doubts about Bercow (he’s my Mum’s MP)but none of that really matters. All those who screamed for the sacking of Mr Martin have absolutely got no right to complain about Bercow’s election.

Janet’s comments about the election are decidedly odd. “It’s we, the electorate…”.
Like the ‘we’ Janet – as Spike Milligan said about Neville Chamberlain’s “We are now at war…” You don’t speak for the electorate, Janet. You speak for yourself.

Nadine Dorries honestly can’t help it.

So don’t be too cruel.

You’re spot on today Tom.

Dhanda has done himself no harm whatsoever this week. He is surely on his way to the front benches if he keeps his seat at the election.

Tom, Dorries is my MP and I’m going to give you examples of how she is behaving with regard to MP’s epenses, you can then judge whether or not to accept this comment. All my data can be checked on the relevant sites. I’ll give a few examples of what she has been saying. From the Mail on Sunday’s anti- Bercow article “I have never claimed for gardening,food,a second home for ducks…or anything else”. In a local newspaper Beds on Sunday 5th June “I want you to know that I have never claimed for food or petty cash…” On her blog, a post entitled Clarification, 21st May..” I have not claimed the £400 per month food” Following her castigation of her rival prospective Labour Candidate, who had been over to Iraq serving in the TA but had used the ambiguous phrase “principles which I fought for in Iraq” she wrote on her Blog a post entitled All’s Fair in War and Politics, 3rd May ” However, one thing I’ve learnt in the battlefield of politics one needs to be absolutely honest AND precise.Nothing less will do”
I glanced through her expense records when they where published (parliament site) Surprise,surprise,In her ACA 06/07 on page 17 a claim for £400 FOOD, page 24 a claim for £400 FOOD, page 36 a claim for £400 FOOD. She has also claimed petty cash, page 61 of the 06/07 Incidentals, accountancy fees 06/07 and average weekly taxi faares of £30 for 40 weeks. The point I’m trying to make is most MPs have ‘abused’ their allowances and accepted it whereas Dorries is trying to give the impression she never did. Snow White she ain’t.

Kirsty: “Three Tory MP’s voted for him. What does that tell you?”

It tells me that you believe everything you hear. It was a secret ballot, so no-one knows how many Tory MPs voted for him. I was surprised that Douglas carswell supported him – there may well have been others. No-one knows or will ever know.

Tom, delighted to hear that you switched to Sir George Young. I felt he made the best speech yesterday and certainly came forward with the best proposals for the reform of parliamentary business.

I really enjoyed Parmjit Dhanda’s speech, I think he could go a long long way. Unfortunately I didn’t agree with any of his suggestions (a combination of half-baked and the plain insane). But you can still respect a man’s energy and passion – he would be far better at presenting the Government’s case than many of the current Cabinet.

I think most Tories – including myself – basically agree with you. Bercow must be given a chance and for the none-too-bright Nadine to knee-jerk comments about removing Bercow following the General election is stupid, given that the last thing that we need is for tit-for-tat actions going from now until Doomsday.

I hope that the Tories who opposed him (not including to my surprise Carswell – a man who like you I like but not necessarily agree with) will give the man a chance.

You never know … he might turn out to be one of the all time great reforming speakers (which is so sorely needed) …

MPs can’t even choose a new Speaker with dignity. Why is nobody surprised?

Still, you’ve got to be happy that it diverts the public’s attention away from what’s important, like crooked MPs, a failing education system, traitors surrendering our sovereignty, crime, police brutality, etc., etc.

God, she is just another Edwina Currie. Give her five more years and she will be writing crap novels and making guest appearances on Countdown.

Where do the Tories dig these people up?

Tom, i didn’t want Bercow as speaker either, but now that he has won i agree that all sides of the house should back him, including all Tories. In saying this i think the onus now falls to Bercow to prove his worth in this regard.

However, in saying this, no matter what you keep saying, i think whilst most labour MPs voted for John for genuine reasons A LOT of Labour MPs voted for John for no other reason than to stick it to the Tory party. You can see it in their faces when the result is announced; smugness rather than happiness. I think that bitterness will live on for a long time.

Regarding Nadine Dorris, i’m a Tory and i pay no attention to the nonsense that falls out of her mouth anyway!

Tom,

Just a quick question… Do you accept that the majority of the public will not be happy with John Bercow as speaker, given that the whole reason for a new speaker was supposedly to clean up the expenses issue, yet Bercow has had among the largest expense claims over the last few years?

Seems to me that his selection is basically Parliament sticking it’s middle finger up at us taxpayers and giving us a gigantic FU.

Having said that, I personally will give him the benefit of the doubt for a few weeks, see how he does. He can hardly be any worse than the chap he replaced.

Z.

There really are some politicians who really need to learn about democracy.

This was a secret ballot, and every MP was given one vote, to cast as they see fit. All that matters is the final count.

It is none of Nadine Dorries’, or anyone else’s, business why MPs voted the way they did. Some Labour MPs may have voted Bercow to spite the Tories, some no doubt voted for him because they feel he’s the best man for the job. It doesn’t really matter. He won, now accept it and let him get on with the job.

Cameron has got to stop these Tories from acting like they’ve already won the election.

@Pete B

Give it up, Shaun.

‘Based on nothing more than the strength of the candidates’ speeches, I voted for Parmjit Dhanda in the first round’

So Parmjit had a dozen or so other mates who wouldn’t let him go down in flames *too* obviously. You knew the first ballot wasn’t crucial for Bercow, Tom.

And I’m sure your support for him had nothing to do with annoying the Tories, you’re much too mature for that.

Game, set and match to Gordon Brown!

Who gives a stuff who is SPeaker?

(apart from political geeks ).

It’s what the MPs do and the way thy behave that matters. So far, the new Speaker has promised to rein in Ministerial announcement made outside Parliament. Our dearly beloved PM has just announced on Radio the new reforms for Parliament.

Should be an interesting test for Mr Bercow. I hope he does not fluff it…

Hmm, not certain why the BBC is running the story that Bercow could be thrown out. We all know it won’t happen (unless it turns out Bercow is actually Osama Bin Laden hiding out in a cunning plan to take over the country by use of expense forms.)

I do agree that the Tories would be better off shutting up – what’s done is done. Actually, I am worried that this is a carefully orchestrated shot across the speakers bows. If the Tories win next year will the speaker be worried by every disapproving frown from the whip ? The biggest problem could be that the speaker doesn’t hold the executive to account.

It is a damn shame that the Labour bloc vote stuck him in charge though – or more precisely, a shame the labour vote didn’t fall behind someone who the public trusted like Frank Field.

Missed opportunity.

Joe K: “I’m sure your support for him had nothing to do with annoying the Tories, you’re much too mature for that.”

Er… you did read the bit where I said I had voted for George Young, didn’t you, Joe?

Can’t wait to hear the righteous indignation when the first act of the new Parliament is to dump Bercow and install Frank Field.

Let’s see how many standing ovations HE gets from the Opposition (Labour) benches.

I largely agree, Tom, but as an outsider looking in, there did seem to be more than an element of petty party politics in electing the Speaker.

A touch naive of me I know, but looking at the contrast of reactions between the Tory and Labour MPs last night, it’s hard not to come to the conclusion that Bercow had been elected mainly to stick two fingers up at the Tories.

Given the expenses row and the very low opinion of Parliament across the country it does appear that the ‘Westminster Village’ is showing contempt to its electorate.

It’s not a good start for the new Speaker to be so obviously disliked by a major party. However, even though I’ve no idea if Bercow will be any good as Speaker, I hope he is and that he’s given a chance.

I agree with your comments regarding Nadine Dorries, she certainly has a history of a lose relationship with the facts (though not as bad as our Dear Leader) and her blogging etiquette is poor to say the least.

Nadine has a habit of ‘going off on one’ then retrospectively editing her blog to pretend it didn’t happen, and also inconsistently approving – or not – comments on her site.

Even today, after criticising the Speaker in the media despite the protocol of not doing so especially a newly elected one, her blog comments are disabled (as I write).

Nadine Dorries could do worse than follow your example, Tom, of how to maintain a proper blog.

I think that the selection of John Bercow is proof positive that you and your ‘honourable’ colleagues just still don’t get it.

Never before has a bunch of so-called representatives failed to grasp what the public are shouting and screaming at them. We can do no more.

As you obviously don’t understand, we will try to spell it out in one syllable words at the next General Election.

Well, seems like Speaker Bercow has his first test and unfortunately, it’s on his first day. It does mean we’ll be able to judge pretty quickly how much of the “manifesto” will be “an aspiration” rather than a promise.

http://waugh.standard.co.uk/2009/06/will-brown-by-reprimanded-by-the-speaker.html

Tom. His first speech was defending MPs against that nasty public! That’s why the public didn’t want him. I congratulate you on your choice as we needed someone with a cool, calm head. Shame we didn’t get it. Bercow does have to get a handle on the House. Stopping pre announcements on the radio, planted question would be a good start. He’s already failed it.

I hope that when we are finally given our election and we have a clean house, someone yells “Nay” and a clean house gets to select a speaker will cross party support.

Paul Waugh really calls out the Tory attacks on Bercow.

http://waugh.standard.co.uk/2009/06/an-example-of-how-tory-mps-loathe-speaker-bercow.html

The protesters (I mean those online at Iain’s blog, and much more so at Guido’s) seem to be either anti-Semitic or anti-Working Class.

All in all, a sign of what will happen if the Tories get elected.

[PS: While I agree Brown and New Labour are driving the public mad with anger, there is no love for the Tories. METRO's poll today had the Tories at 30%. There is no reason Labour cannot win at the next election with just a few judicious changes....]

Labour showed disrespect to the House by deliberately electing someone who is despised by the Opposition. Perhaps likewise the Tories by selecting an Old Etonian, although Labour MPs antipathy to Etonians strikes me as prejudice.

In the days when members were honourable, we needed fewer rules, but I think the next Speaker should be required to get more than 50% of each of the Government and Opposition benches. If no one reaches this, then new nominations would be required. Consensus might be found surprisingly quickly.

Mind you, this could backfire on Labour. Labour have already given him what he wanted. He now needs to suck up to the Tories.

@John Mark

‘In the days when members were honourable, we needed fewer rules.’

That kind of remark interests me. When were MPs generally more honourable than they are now? In Wilson’s day? Robert Maxwell was a Labour MP. George Wigg got done for kerb-crawling. Macmillan’s day? Bob Boothby? John Profumo to name but two? The thirties when certain Tory MPs were open admirers of the Nazis and certain famous Fabians admirers of Stalin? Lloyd George’s time?

[...] The Tories Must Accept the New Speaker [...]

‘He now needs to suck up to the Tories’
I don’t think so.
He should not be ’sucking up’ to anyone.

There seems to be quite a few Tories who believe that the Labour MPs should have been whipped by the opposition front bench to vote for whoever the Tory leadership decided. Somehow they think that the expenses debacle should have led to the resignation of Michael Martin and the appointment of whichever candidate the Tory leadership wanted.
This is utterly insane.

I have one thing to say to Ms Dorries: Go Nads!

Tom, did you honestly expect better from Nadine Dorries?

I thought for a while that Berocw would get the job. I even thought for a while that he deserved it. But I am a recluse, greatly detached, and for good reason, from the real world. I have been forced to learn things in the last few days. I always have to be forced to learn things.

I now agree that George Young was the man for the job. Our host saw that but too late. As it is, we have been landed with a character who has to prove his character, or invent it, rather than one whose good character was in little doubt. As a result we have a house divided at a time when unity in the service of honesty was most needed. The Tories are no better than Labour in this respect but Labour are no better than the Tories. The country is settling to the impression that, despite all that has happened in recent weeks, they still listen only to each other and still work to score against each other with no thought for the country. It was always this way. What a pity it still is.

Tom,

The election of Bercow by Labour is, like the redacted expenses, clear indication that you guys clearly like pissing all over us. It’s a complete insult after the happenings of the last month or so, and further evidence of the fact that this government is long past its sell-by date and smelling very nasty.

General election now please. This is beyond a joke.

Is the House capable of respecting the court of Public Opinion? (Tom, feel free to call in the Blessed “Miss Equality” Harman (to be achieved by dragging everyone down to the level of the lowest common denominator) on this one

Future expenses to remain redacted. Who gives a shot what the public think?

@Tom

‘Joe K: “I’m sure your support for him had nothing to do with annoying the Tories, you’re much too mature for that.”

Er… you did read the bit where I said I had voted for George Young, didn’t you, Joe?’

You didn’t choose to allow my response, presumably because it answered your typically patronising (I use the word, because the boot fits) retort. You probably won’t allow this one for the same reason, but reverse psychology is alway worth a try…

Yes, you supported Bercow, as your entry makes clear, and we still have no reason to think that wasn’t because it would rile the ‘dead Tories’ you see everywhere on your blog, as well as those in parliament. Maybe you switched to Young because you knew it was in the bag for Bercow, I haven’t looked at the figures. I just know that for someone who takes such a different attitude to my own MP when it comes to blogland, you let yourself down somewhat with this snide streak which most of your accolytes seem to miss. Even if you think someone deserves to be talked down to, that doesn’t mean it’s wise to do so.

Argh, fell asleep on the sofa, but still didn’t get enough sleep…

Bercow has been elected. He wasn’t my choice, indeed he wasn’t in my top six or seven choices, but such is life. We will see him in office for the next eleven months, and be able to judge him on his merits. A year from now there will be a new house of commons, and it is up to them to decide who they wish to have as speaker. It is a little obscure to suggest however that it would be disrespectful of democracy if they were to decide to make their own choice rather than automatically continue the choice of the current house, many of whom will no longer be in the house.

Until the election however respect the office and hope that Bercow is a credit to it.

Bercow will be dropped after the next election.