And another thing…

Well, it could be worse. As George Foulkes joked: “I’d like to congratulate him for resisting the urge to put himself on it. He has shown commendable self-discipline.” Indeed!

You should be looking a bit closer to home Tom. The City Chambers flies the saltire EVERY DAY except when they fly other country’s flags – did you know they flew the flag of Finland on Finnish INDEPENDENVE DAY??? How sinister is that?

Yes, the fascist nat agenda having swallowed up Glasgow City Council is seeping through the streets of this fine northern British city like the black death.

Are you aware for example of a private cab firm known as “Hampden Cabs” – whose vehicles all have a saltire on them? What a disgrace.

Even worse is the sinister and secretive labyrinth – Hampden itself – in which hordes of so-called Scotland supporters frequently gather to display their saltires and indulge in all kinds of Nuremberg-like frenzied flag waving nationalistic insanity. I am amazed you don’t know about it as this hell hole is slap bang in the middle of YOUR CONSTITUENCY.

You should get it shut down, your voters will thank you.

Fine work though in pointing out that the saltire as a symbol of St Andrew has absolutely nothing to do with Christianity. Good point well made.

And there’s no “Season of good will” in England while we toil under the yoke of the hated Scot!

And I mean that most sincerely.

You feeling alright, Indy? Has someone criticised the use of the St Andrew’s flag somewhere? Well, you just send them along to me and I’ll give ‘em what for….

Point of fact, I’m a big of a fan of Gerald Burns, and if I but had the money I’d buy the canvas in a split-second…

The girl isn’t frowning, she’s looking out with a hint of a smile.

As for those going on about “nationalism” because the card has a Saltire in it, I have written an extensive post on the matter that I’ll not repeat here since it’s a bit of a long one….

http://voxpopulivoxscoti.blogspot.com/

I agree it’s just a Christmas card but that hasn’t stopped the SNP’s opponents from calling it “Stalinist” simply because it has a saltire on it.

Incidentally the wee girl in the picture is a real wee girl – she is the artist’s niece – so it’s a bit rude to say she looks like a Midwich Cuckoo.

Over the years I have taken an interest in the rise and fall of the Third Reich. In relation to flag waving and images, certain clear messages were intended by the use of the flag and by the use of blue-eyed blond young women being the flag bearer, usually depicted with a wistful, if vacant stare into the horizon and usually, if not always, wearing some kind of uniform.

The meaning was clear; the task of carrying forward the Nazi ideal was born on the shoulders of the young, perfect, Aryan child, who, after certain “cleansing” activities had taken place, would bring about the rise of Germany, uber alles.

We live in a world, I am afraid, of connotations. Had this been the chosen picture of the BNP, only with the use of the Union flag, people would have been up in arms, and certainly have made comparisons with Hitler’s ideal.

And by the way, WTF has it to do with celebrating the birth of the Saviour, Jesus Christ? Frigthened of upsetting certain sections of the community are we, or is this just another glib example of the secularisation of the most important festival, of the most important religion in this country?

Surprised she doesn’t have a sword in her hand just to make a point….

Math: “The girl isn’t frowning, she’s looking out with a hint of a smile.”

She looks like a Midwich Cuckoo!

That look of noble melancholy is really her thinking: ‘How much have I got to stand here … this flag pole weighs a *!#?* ton … and I bet I’ve missed Spongebob …’

Yeah Tom, God forbid that the SCOTTISH Government should have a SCOTTISH flag on its Christmas cards.
I certainly don’t see the Saltire as a symbol of independence – you apparently do. Perhaps you should start a campaign to criminalise its display. How very New Labour that would be.

Sorry, I seem to be missing something here… Have I criticised the use of the flag on the card? No, I’m criticising the fact that the young woman pictured isn’t exactly filled with Christmas cheer.

Wait a minute _ I’ve just worked it out. Nats are so hyper-sensitive about any criticism of their party of their leader that they react to criticism before it’s even given. That’s it, isn’t it? You were all expecting criticism for having a St Andrew’s flag on the card., so when a Labour MP does express some criticism, you assume it’s to do with the flag, so react without bothering to read the actual post! Fantastic!

“They may take our sense of humour, but they will never take our FREEEEEDUMB!”

Seasons Greetings to you all, it’s an Xmas card.

Moved up here a few months ago, and the problem of the Unionist cause seems to me to be every bit a cultural one as much as a political one. The media establishment especially seems to have swallowed the whole narrative unthinkingly.

http://michaeltmerrick.wordpress.com/2009/12/09/scotlands-empire/

Actually I quite like it.

So does it constitute a X-mas card, yes. Its a winter scene, not overly religous as is appropiate nowadays. And is from a succesful Scottish artist who tends to use friends and family as subjects and that is the main purpose of X-mas for most, friends and family. And of course he has done religous works as well and the card has a feeling of hope in these troubled times.

No the problems with it show more about the problems that Labour has and its views, than anything to do with the card itself.

I am glad you understand how we feel about Labour. Its about 10 time more than you feel abot the SNP.

Indy at 11.19 am: Of course, I wouldn’t want to offend a wee girl! She’s beautiful, if just a bit glum-looking.

Wrinkled Weasel: I have to take issue with you that Christmas is “the most important festival, of the most important religion in this country.” Christmas is nothing of the sort – It’s likely that even St Paul knew nothing of the Christmas story. Easter is by far more significant.

I wrote about this last year.

@Math Campbell
Very strange smile, it’s turned upside down. I thought those upside down smiles had another name.

She appears very sad to me, thinking of Mr Salmond being in charge perhaps.

@wrinkled weasel
You know very well that Christmas isn’t the most important Christian festival. The most popular perhaps but not the most important.

Yes, Easter is far more significant and I realised that the second after I pressed the submit comment button. Silly me.

My father in law was born on Christmas Day, but on principle, he gets two presents. I wonder if Jesus did?

However, if people want a festival in winter, why not go the whole hog and stop pretending it has anything to do with Christian symbolism? After all, we don’t want to offend anybody.

Thank you wrinkled weasel that was very funny, it was nearly as funny as the Stalinist comment in the Herald yesterday.

I do love you unionists. Moffat compares Salmond to Hitler, Foulkes compares him to Mussolini, and now even a Christmas card is cause for comparisons to Hitler and Stalin. Why not Pol Pot too?

You guys really do have vivid imaginations, keep up the good work.

It’s just a sweet, little legend, providing a wonderful excuse for both kids and grown-ups to have a fun time.

Why bring ancient, religious piffle into it?

@wrinkled weasel
Well Jesus did get Gold, Frankinsence and Myrrh; but that was from the three wise men 12 days after his birth.

Not sure if the shepherds gave any gift apart from their love, but that likely counts more than any other gift.

Actually Tom, you brought in the talk of the saltire by suggesting the SNP are anti-English.

Ridiculous of course. I’m an SNP member, have an accent you could practically play polo with, never once had even the slightest problem with anyone.

Your talk of the SNP being anti-English with this card brings with it the tacit suggestion the card is anti-English and also therefore pro-Scottish, although why pro-Union folks like yourself think it’s impossible for someone to be pro-England AND pro-Scotland at the same time I don’t know…

You are covertly attacking the saltire Tom, whether you set out to or not. And the Lib-Dems and Tories most definitely are.
Haven’t seen that much from any Labour MSP’s except for Foulkes who made an admittedly mostly-humerous comment about it being good the FM resisted the chance to put his photo on it.

Whether you’re for the Union with England or against it, you should most definitely be proud of Scotland as a country. I get the feeling some in Labour are not…

Salmond is a down at heel version of the Scunner Campbell:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Gran

I was amused to read Sir Iain Dale’s suggestion that the other parties should let him hijack the Scottish (and UK) political agendas:

http://iaindale.blogspot.com/2009/11/scottish-parties-are-blind-to-obvious.html

Obvious SuperGran wouldn’t have allowed that, Scottish public not all that keen either . . .

It’s a very striking picture – it rather reminds me of book jackets of children’s novels with a supernatural theme. The theme will often be: city child goes to live in remote area, where some of the locals seem a bit strange, mad or simple. There will be some kind of local cult/primeval force thing going on.

For some reason they’d often be set in Norfolk – I’ve no idea why that would be.

Hello Observer. Thank You! I now have the distinction, possibly the lone distinction, of being called both a cybernat and a unionist on the same blog.

As it happens, and if you ever read the comments on this blog or my blog, you would know that I have voted SNP for years!

I don’t play tribal politics and I certainly don’t owe the Nats (or anybody) my undying loyalty. I call it as I see it. All forms of Nationalism stray into the realms of political extremism from time to time. My preference is that they make sure they understand the possible negative connotations that can be extrapolated from blond, blue-eyed, flag-waving Aryans in uniform, especially when the said depictions are used to exploit the otherwise benign tradition of exchanging Seasonal greetings.

I think she just looks rather serious. I am English with a Scots ancestry and a supporter of the Union, but I would be happy to have that picture on my wall.

I decry any politicisation of Christmas, beyond the charities which celebrate the occasion with their causes on cards, let alone the intrusion of nationalism into a Christian festival, with roots in other seasonal celebrations.

Many obtain goodwill who might not seen to deserve it.

Thought it looked familiar

see URL

A young Scots lass looking thoughtful and holding her country’s flag, painted by a respected Scots artist.

It must be quite difficult not to appear to be scoring cheap points or being petty when criticising such a thing.

Maybe her rather sober and serious look is reflecting the utter misery that the season of goodwill evokes in so many people.

I work in areas of multiple deprivation. Unemployed people or people with part time jobs, single parents with 3 or 4 kids to buy for, people who are sick, and the old trying to struggle through a long dark Scottish winter on little or no money, people trying to live on the minimum wage. All of them find Christmas hard. Oh yes, lots of them will smile and wish you happy Christmas and some of them will have a good bevy, but show me one of them who’s not worried that his or her kids won’t have what they want.

I’ve had lads walking 5 miles to a course and walking back too, in the rain with inadequate clothing to get the bus fares so that they can buy a wee extra for their bairns.

I admit it. Christmas makes me miserable now because I know how many people will be ashamed and miserable, and so many will have their loneliness heightened by the fact that this is the time when everyone gets together with their family, and it is all sweetness and light…except for them stuck with another day of second rate television with santa clause showing up of every programme just to remind them that everyone else is having enforced fun.

Och sorry to be an old misery Tom. But there is a lot of unhappiness out there. It’s a pity the Christian Churches have allowed their celebration of Christ’s birth to be hijacked by big business to create such unhappiness..

WW comments kind of illustrate the bizarreness of this debate.

Most interested in the seamless link between the suggestion of Aryan supremacy and the suggestion that the card was chosen not to offend non-Christian ethnic groups.

Bit of a discrepancy there, since Aryan suprenacists tend not to care of they offend Muslims, Jews, Bhuddists or Hindus etc….

PS: The saltire is of course a symbol of St Andrew. It’s a Christian symbol as well as our national flag. That’s what it has to do with Christmas.

Many countries have flags which represent Saints, St George, St Patrick obvious examples.

I wonder how the SNP would react if HM the Queen, or Gordon Brown sent out Union Jack Christmas cards?

Why shouldn’t Gordon Brown use the flag if he wants to?

Some of the Queen’s other realms might be a little miffed if she used a Union flag on her Christmas cards. She is equally Queen of Canada, New Zealand and a host of other countries that might be offended to be excluded.